How To Get Mega Publicity For Your Fitness Business

Recently I grilled my buddy Rocco Castellano about how he gets so much damn publicity for his fitness business. And as usual, Rocco had plenty to say…

I want to talk to your readers and your listeners about is how to get the maximum benefits from publicity because publicity really isn't about press releases. A good friend of mine — Jim Labadie — talks about piggybacking off of different events with press releases and I'm personally not a big fan of press releases. I use press releases but I like to develop relationships with the media and with the press. It's very important — that's one of the best characteristics of what I do is develop relationships with the media.

Now, sometimes it's an adversarial relationship with the media because just by existing I'm kind of controversial. Or I found trainers, especially fitness professional or trainers, tend to tell the media what they think they want to hear. And that's something that should never happen. I don't think that anyone should try to figure out what the press or the media wants to hear and I've seen so many people fall on their faces when they try to be bland and average. And I always tell our trainers, if you're edgy, if you're out there, be yourself and always have an opinion. If you don't have an opinion then nobody cares about you and nobody really gives a sh*t what you have to say.

Every trainer out there — there's over 100,000 trainers or fitness professionals out there right now in America. The odds are against you right away so the more that you can be yourself — if you're a nice person but have really good information, or if you're a guy like me who wants to bust the system every chance he gets — I consider myself the anti-fitness industry fitness guru because I don't necessarily like what the fitness industry propagates on a daily basis. So I really go against so many of the traditional money-making things and the way that people are constantly trying to sell things or shove things down people's throat. So I really want the trainers to start to be themselves and to develop a personal style that the media can either grow to love or grow to hate, because either or — and that's the way that I live, Chris.

I live on a daily basis — I want people to either love me or hate me. I don't necessarily want people to like me because if people just like me, they're not talking about me. They're just like, "Oh, you know, that Rocco guy, he's kind of cool." But if somebody loves you, they're always going to be talking about you and that is real publicity. The publicity that you get in newspapers or on radio or on TV is good, but when you have people talking about you — I mean, I've heard stories from different people that I'm personally the content of a conversation at a wedding, at a rehearsal dinner, at a class reunion. And I'm like, "Why the hell would I want to be –" or, "Why am I the topic of conversation in these different areas and these different events?" And it's because I've changed people's lives. And when you set out to change people's lives, then you are without a doubt going to be talked about.

Now, on the flipside of that, I've rubbed people the wrong way because I use the word "fat." I have no problem telling somebody that if they're going to eat like they're going to the chair that they're going to stay fat and to really not bother me with their bullshit. And some people get offended by that. I use the "f" word — "fat" — and I also use the other "f" word.

So people do get offended by me but I've literally been in a restaurant and a bar and heard a conversation about my column and how one person loved the column, loved the honesty, loved the — "You don't really get that type of honesty and the truth about anything. Everybody's trying to sell you something," and whatever. And then the other person absolutely hated me and they're like, "He's an asshole. Why would you read that garbage? He's so mean and all that." And so there was a dialogue, there was a real dialogue between two people that loved me and that hated me and I was just eating it up. That kind of just fills your ego.

And I went over to them, like the asshole that I could be, and I introduced myself and said, "Hi. I'm Rocco Castellano, your topic of conversation." And they both basically fell — their jaws dropped and I bought them a drink and said, "Thank you for the entertainment," and I left. And I got an e-mail from both of them the next day. It was just awesome. And the one was ranting about how different — like, the person that hated me figured out how different I was than my column, or that I was nicer. Even though I thought I was being an asshole, they thought that I was a lot more human than my column was. So I converted them over to loving me.

But I've had people come up to me — and this is the greatest honor. I have to tell you this. This is probably one of the greatest things that I've ever heard in my life. And I've talked about this in other interviews also, but when you can create just an emotional response in people, in your writing, in your radio interviews, in your TV appearances, that is what is going to trigger a response for people to buy from you or to get your products or just to go to your website.

And one thing that I've always loved is that there was — this woman came up to me at a charity event, or like a social event that I was at, came up to me and just started yelling at me and was like, "You know what? Your column sucks. I can't believe you're that mean. You shouldn't be calling people out like that. The way that you write is just not good for people," and all this, just ranting on and on and on. And while she was ranting she literally said these words. She said, "I read your column every week." Let me say that again. "I read your column every week and I can't stand what you write."

Like that Howard Stern thing.

That's exactly what it is. So people that hate me read my column, but now the column has become a destination page for these people that hate me so that they have something to talk about me around the water cooler or whatever. So now my column has become a premium page and the newspaper charges more money for ads to be on my page because they know that the readership is going to that destination page. And I get a percentage of the revenue on that page.

I think that it's so ironic that people that hate me I get paid by.

It's amazing. But that's something that I just — one thing that I recommend, if you're looking to get publicity one thing that I really recommend for trainers to do — and I talk about this in my seminars a lot — is if you don't know how to write or if you think you know how to write, go take a college class in a creative writing or a journalism class about writing so that you can have an idea of how to put sentences together, because I've taught and I've gotten press releases from trainers that don't make any sense. So instead of just worrying about your business, you ought to invest time in other things to help with you to work on your business. And that's one of those things that I think that trainers need to know how to do is to learn how to write and be effective in their writing.

Now, if you don't want to know how to write, you can always pay somebody $75 to $150 to write a press release that should take you about 10 minutes. So I always recommend that somebody takes a writing course. I did that. And I've always been a decent writer, not an unbelievable writer, but I get my point across and I like to write in a conversational style. So when you hear me speak, you'll definitely know that that was written by this Rocco guy. But again, like I said, press releases are good; I just believe that people should learn how to develop a relationship with the media.

And what I have been able to do very successfully is call the media and the average person doesn't realize that reporters, anchor people, radio producers and radio personalities actually answer their own phones. The radio industry and the newspaper industry is so scaled down and downsized that the reporters have to deal with their own stuff. So if you look in the newspaper and you see an article that was about fitness that you either liked or didn't like — if you didn't like something that you read or you thought that the facts weren't straight or that you could offer more to that story, then look up — and don't e-mail these people because they get inundated with e-mails every single day, just like I do. I get over 2,500 e-mails every single week. If you e-mail me, I want to punch you in the face because I'd rather talk to you. And that's why I do these interviews because I'd rather be in touch with a live person than be e-mailed in five billion e-mails. So reporters are the same way.

Now, they'll e-mail you back because that's what they do because they can type like a million words a minute. But the best thing to do is to call them and just introduce yourself because they'll pick up the phone. If they have a voice mail, don't leave a message. Just keep calling back until you get them on the phone live so that you can have a conversation with them. And just introduce yourself and explain why you called. About the article, "This article about trans-fats, I don't know if you really understand all the facts about what's happening here, but I'd just like to be a resource for you. And if you're thinking about ever doing another article like that I'd love to add my two cents if that's all right." And what reporters do is they have a database of sources and it's always good to put your name and your phone number and your address in that database because they will call you, because they don't want to constantly use the same source.

So that's one thing that I was always good at is just — and so many things would piss me off. And I'm not one of those people with a really bad temper or anything like that, but I don't know if you've been there, Chris, but you'll read an article in the newspaper and you go, "Who was the source on this? Because it just doesn't make sense." And I've seen so many articles and I'm like, "What is that?" I mean, I can't even believe that this person is even training people.

So I would get on the phone. I'd go in all the phone numbers — if you don't know this out there, all the phone numbers and the main office phone numbers and all that are on the front or the first three pages within the newspaper. So just look in the left hand corner of the newspaper in the first three pages and you'll see. It's also in magazines too; you'll see the publisher, all that stuff. So you call the main number and ask for that reporter and you'll get them. So just call them and call them and call them until you get through, and at some point in time they will call you.

And the same goes for radio. Now, I believe the two best — now, other people will differ on this than me, but I believe that the two best publicity avenues are print and radio. And print is because what I found is that just because something ran in the Saturday paper or the Sunday paper a lot of trainers have said — and I've even gotten pissed off that I haven't gotten any calls or customers — and I'll usually get about five to seven calls from any publicity that I do in the newspaper. And that's about average, unless it's something really controversial I'll get, like, 25 calls. But the average is about seven and you'll probably get about two customers out of that.

But the thing about the print newspaper or that third party endorsement by that reporter is that people will cut it out of the newspaper and put it on their refrigerator, on their bathroom mirror or something like that, and it will stay and it has staying power in their home or in their college dorm or in their office and they'll look at it every single day. They might not call you because, like with me, everyone thinks that I'm this maniacal drill sergeant type of trainer where I just beat people up and I love it and I'm a sadistic MF, you know? So people have to kind of build themselves up to call me, but that's good. That's what I want people to do because I don't want somebody just to call me and waste my time. I want people to qualify themselves before they even call me so that I know that they're committed. That newspaper article will — I've had people that have told me that they've had that article on their refrigerator for six months and then they finally got up the courage or the balls to call me, and they finally called me six months later. So that one article got me something six months later and that's pretty cool staying power.

Radio, on the other hand, is something that I think is really awesome because you're able to get through your voice, hopefully, your personality and what you're about, if you're good at speaking. Now, I'm not the best speaker in the world. Obviously if you're listening to this interview, I stutter sometimes and I'll say, "I'm –" or whatever. But you can get my personality and where I'm coming from from me speaking. And that's kind of what you want to do when you're doing a radio interview. And what I do — Chris, you really haven't said too many words, but the thing is that I've learned how, from being on radio for the past 12 years — and I kind of learned — I mean, I'm kind of talking out of turn here, but I was on a radio show with a two-time Marconi winner named Gary Burbank on one of the top radio comedy shows for a long time. So I learned from the best.

Gary Burbank is one of the funniest people in the world and if you don't learn how to be quick-witted and how to deliver a comeback to him, he'll eat you alive and bury you on the radio. So I learned how to do that and in turn he taught me how to be interviewed and how to fill up time. Because talking for three minutes or talking for 10 minutes or talking for 30 minutes is a long time if you have nothing to say, and you really never want the interviewer or the radio host to be guiding you because they can guide you into some pitfalls. And you never want to be steered into a corner, so you always want to direct that conversation. And that conversation has to have three specific points. So whatever you are trying to get across, you make sure that there are three points that you have to hammer home, and you can always come back to them. So if the host steers you in a different direction, you can bring it back. And that's a whole other actual series of interviews that I can talk to you about.

You want to feel comfortable in your skin when you're on the radio. If you don't feel comfortable, do not — do not get on the radio because the listeners or the people that are listening to that show are going to feel your fear and they'll hear it in your voice.

How can someone build up to being comfortable if they've never been on the radio before? And, say they're not comfortable with that but they want to get comfortable with it, what can they do?

This sounds absolutely crazy, but talk to yourself. Have conversations with yourself. Or just have conversations — get a microphone and do interviews with a friend of yours or with your wife, your spouse, your girlfriend, people that you feel comfortable with. And what I did when I started radio — because I stuttered really bad and I was scared to death that I would sound stupid. So I would go into the studio or I would get on the telephone with people and I would just practice speaking for lengths of time. And I would have people ask me questions that were out there, that were just opinion-related questions. It had nothing to do with fitness. So when you are given a question that doesn't necessarily deal with fitness, you can answer it and your opinion counts because you never want to –

I mean, I'm asked a lot of times to send related questions. Like, the hosts or the producers will ask me to send them eight questions that I would want the host to ask me. And I usually write back, "Ask me whatever you want," because if you need my advice on what to ask me, I don't want to be on your radio show. You're the host. This is what you're supposed to be doing. That kind of pisses people off, though. So if you're not comfortable with pissing people off then I recommend you send back questions that you feel comfortable answering. But also, send back questions that aren't the typical questions, like, "So, Rocco, how does your plan lose fat for people?" I mean, everyone has asked that stupid-ass question. So if you can send back questions that are more controversial or get people in their emotional core, then that will prompt that host to ask you back because it's more of a conversation now and not a sales pitch for a product.

And that's one thing you never want to do in an interview and that's something I very, very rarely do is talk about my product. Or if I do talk about my product, I say, "I'm going to give you a shameless plug," and I'll make fun of it because it's just not something that hosts like if you go, "In my book –" or, "On page 28 it talks about how this, this, this and this." They're going to get pissed off at you.

Yeah. No one likes a pitch-fest, man.

Well, and they don't want you to be using them. Although you are using them; I mean, they know that. They know that you're using them to promote a product. It has to be within the relevant content of the show. So if you just blurt out, "In my book on page whatever it clearly explains this," you're not going to win anybody's favor at all. So what you want to do is talk about your programs within the content.

So when somebody says, "In your program you're able to get somebody to lose 30 pounds in 30 days? How is that possible?"

"Well, to tell you the truth, Chris, I did it on MTV's MADE and I clearly showed millions of viewers how that happened." So I didn't say, "Buy my 30 In 30 product." I kind of diverted and explained and gave proof of how it works.

So tell us about the MADE show. How did you get on MADE and tell us what the show is about? I think it won some awards and stuff. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Yeah, sure. Well, getting on TV is really — unless you're a personality or unless you have something to offer in the realm of entertainment you're really not going to get on TV that much. So you'll get the occasional interview if you have something that — if they're having a slow day, a morning show will have you on, you know? But how I got on MADE was I train a lot of beauty queens for Miss USA and some in Miss America, but the Miss America system kind of has a lot of fat girls anyway.

So I like going after the model but all my clients would wait until six weeks before the pageant and, "I don't know what to do. I'm, like, 20 pounds overweight and I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this pageant." And they're crying.

So I developed a program that safely — although it's very intense and people hate me when they're going through it — I developed programs and a specific program to help to lose fat very, very quickly and safely. So through that and being in the newspaper and all that, and then I had a client that I helped drop 50 pounds in three months and she wanted to go to some Halloween party and look really, really hot. So I helped her with that and she happened to be — do this whole stripper fitness stuff and MTV called her for this thing. They never really used her, but they called her and she said that — they were asking about trainers and she basically said that if you don't use this guy Rocco, you're insane.

And they did research on me and went to my website, saw what I was about, and they called me and I met with them in New York. I was going to New York on business anyway and I met with them and that's kind of what I'm talking about is I made the effort. Now, they probably would have hired me anyway for the show, but I made the effort and I went to their offices in New York to shake hands, to find out people's names and actually put a life face to a name that I was going to be e-mailing. And that went a long way. That went a really long way because they were calling me for advice on what they should do.

Like, there was one time where the writer called me and said, "Listen, Rocco. There's not enough drama in this. Can you break her today? Can you make her cry?"

And I said, "Of course I can. What would you like me to do?"

Now, any time that you have somebody that's fat that can't do something, you're going to make them cry. So I just made her do mountain climbers and it just kicked her ass and I made her cry. But there would not have been that relationship if I didn't go and meet that writer in New York.

So when we started to do the show it was supposed to be for six weeks but they cut it down to four weeks. So I only had 30 days to get this weight off of her and the MTV people only wanted 20 pounds off of her. But the second that she came in — she was supposed to be 185 when I got her. When she came to do the consultation with me she was 219. And I was flipping out. I was like, "You have to be kidding me. If you drop 20 pounds, you're still 200 pounds. You still look fat."

So I had to literally — I told MTV, "I have to drop 30 pounds. This is going to be very ugly. It's going to get messy but I'm going to take 30 pounds off her in the next 30 days."

They were so impressed with that — they didn't believe that I could do it and I did it. And so that started a whole different ball rolling. And so unbeknownst to me, I had other people in the background basically cheering me on and also thinking about a spin-off or a TV show of my own. I didn't even know this.

But that's one thing that I want to tell the trainers out there and the fitness professionals out there, that for three years I was trying to put together a TV show and a pilot because a lot of people came to me with this great idea, "You should have your own TV show. Your personality is great." This, this, and that. So I went through all these hoops and jumping through every hoop you can think of to try to get this TV show and one producer literally told me that I should spend $120,000 with his production company to get this pilot done and that I shouldn't do the MADE show. That I shouldn't do MADE on MTV because it's not going to do anything for me.

Meanwhile, I'm thinking to myself, "You know what? I'm going to do the show anyway and I'm going to see what happens."

Well, I went with my gut and the show won an Emmy. My episode was one that was considered for the Emmy and it won. So now I have a little plaque in my office that says I contributed to the Emmy-winning show. But it was because I did that, I went against what everybody else was saying. Now we kind of have proof that what I do works. First of all, it won the Emmy. Second, you can see on TV.

So that right there confirmed the fact that I could do TV. And that was shown to so many different people because of the Emmy nominations that I started getting calls from all of these people that went, "Holy shit. This is awesome. Can you do this show for us? Can you do this? Would you be willing to be interviewed on this?"

So I'm going to tell you, listen to your gut a lot of times, because what I've always wanted was to be on TV. But being on TV, unless you have your own TV show or your own TV segment on a news program or something like that, it doesn't really help you. If you're on a morning show one time it kind of fills your ego, but not too many people watch it or they're not paying attention enough for you to get any real calls from that. And I know a lot of people are going to differ on that subject with me, but I found that the more that I was on radio and the more that I was — like, my syndicated column doesn't necessarily give me that many calls; it's just a really cool thing that I'm able to do. I write one column a week and it's sent out to like 25 different newspapers. So that's kind of cool. But it doesn't necessarily sell products for me all the time.

What does sell me and what does get my name out there more is when a radio host, a reporter for a newspaper, or even like a TV anchor person or a reporter is the one that's doing the interview. A lot of people say, "I write for 'Muscle and Fitness' –" which I do, but that doesn't necessarily get me a lot of customers. It just puts my name out there, but it doesn't necessarily give people the confidence that somebody else believes in my product. And that's what you kind of want is you want that third party endorsement.

So to go over what I was talking about, because you asked me about MADE, is that that was a really cool third party endorsement and that also was able to show my programs and my ability to put my money where my mouth was. So somebody was able to actually see what I was capable of doing. Now, that right there gave me so many hits to my website. It gave me the opportunity to be able to get fans. And that's kind of what we in the fitness industry need.

And I don't know if you talk about this a lot, Chris, but I believe that we don't need customers and we don't need people purchasing stuff. We need fans. We need people talking about us on a daily basis. If people aren't talking about you there's something wrong with what you're doing because any time that there is a conversation being had about you– I mean, I've had talk show hosts literally have conversations about me on the radio and I wasn't even there, and because of something that I was doing. And that is — you need to be socially conscious and you need to be out there.

Most of the trainers that are going to be listening to this are basically stuck in the gym, and that's a shame. If you're stuck in the gym working, working, working and just are trying to make money, at some point in time you're going to burn out, one; second, you're not going to be able to do what you do best because there's no diversity in your life. And like I said, the best publicity is going out there and networking and most trainers either don't know how to do it or they are afraid to go out and meet people. And one thing that I do well and I'm pretty successful at is working the room. But you can't just be working the room trying to sell things because if you're trying to sell yourself it comes off as really insincere. And if you're insincere people are going to call you an asshole and not even bother with you.

So you definitely want to be involved in as many functions as possible — either charity or social functions or business groups. I was voted one of the top 40 businessmen under 40 in Cincinnati and so that put me in this elite group. But every year, three times a year they have these functions where I get to meet and talk to other professionals in the — that was back in Cincinnati with these Cincinnati professionals and be able to talk to them on a personal level.

The same thing goes for chambers of commerce. You've got to get involved with these people because at some point these people may be fat, they may want to get into shape, but they have influence over other people, and especially employees. If you're thinking about developing a corporate fitness or corporate wellness program you need to get involved in these different groups.

And I'm a huge fan of local music, so I would always go to anywhere where local music was playing and develop relationships with the musicians or with people that are related to that industry, one, because I love it; but also because there were other people, like reporters there, radio personalities there, and things like that. And that's something else that I'm going to get into is that if you want to get on the radio or get in the newspaper or get on TV, one of my secret weapons was always go where the reporters are or go where the radio personalities are.

And my biggest success, the way that I was able to get on the number radio or talk show in Cincinnati, the Gary Burbank show, I went to where the general manager of the radio show would go. He would go the same restaurant all the time. And it just so happened that he's Italian and I'm Italian, so I developed – I went up to him, said, "Hey, Rick. How are you? I'm Rocco Castellano. I'm a fitness expert here in Cincinnati. I just wanted to come up and talk to you and say hi. We fellow Italians have to stick together." And that was basically the introduction that I gave to him and then we just started talking. And I found out that he was from Cleveland and he found out that I was from Jersey and New York and we just had a conversation. We literally talked for, like, two hours after the introduction.

And then what happened was, three weeks later he called me and said, "Hey, Gary Burbank was thinking about having a fitness professional on the show. Could you come up?"

And I was like, "Yeah, sure."

Well, I got up there, was on the show, and Gary loved my laugh. It wasn't even what the content of what I was saying. He just liked the way that I laughed and the energy that I brought to the room and he asked me to be on the show permanently. So nothing that I had to say meant anything to him; it was the energy that I brought to the show and my laugh. So he asked me if I could come to the show every day for three hours and that they would pay me to be on the show.

Well, I was honored but I couldn't be on the show for that long because I wasn't making the money that I would be doing personal training. But I stayed on a segment of the show called "Sports or Consequences." And it was a really menial thing, but it got my name to be a household name. And the name Rocco is a very rare name in Cincinnati, so I think there's like two people named Rocco, me and some old guy that's like 85 years old.

So I was on the show for eight and a half years and it just made my name a household name. I would see people out all the time and my voice is very distinctive, especially in Cincinnati. So people would hear my voice and they would be like, "Are you that Rocco guy that's on the Gary Burbank show?" So it really helped to produce more publicity for me because when a brand new newspaper come out — it was called "CiN Weekly" and it was just a weekly newspaper that was geared towards young professionals. But very short, like sound byte-ish, articles. They didn't have a health and fitness section in their newspaper so I just called them up and asked for the editor.

I got on the phone with the editor and said "I'm Rocco Castellano. I don't know if you know me."

He said, "Yeah, Rocco, from the Gary Burbank show, right?" Like, doing my accent. So he was like, "Send me something. I'd love to do a column like that. That's exactly what I've been looking for."

So I got on the phone. He knew me from the radio and the deal was signed. And then from that I started working the syndication route and then somebody else saw my column and wanted to help me. So one thing that I'm going to tell the trainers is always take action. Jim Labadie talks about this and Pat Rigsby talks about it all the time. But if you don't take action — it may be the wrong action sometimes because I've done some things that were absolutely the wrong thing to do. But the funny thing about what happened was that I learned something about what not to do and sometimes even a mistake turned into something good for me because somebody saw it and was like, "Roc, that absolutely sucked," or, "that was so stupid but I think that if you did it this way it may work." And so I had somebody else helping me, mentoring me because they saw that I had the energy and that I was willing to take action; I just didn't have direction. So that's something else that absolutely needs to be done when you're looking to get publicity and you're looking to get your name out there.

Getting your name out there isn't just, like I said, isn't just press releases and getting in newspapers, on the radio, or TV. You need people to be talking about you. And the way that people talk about you is you develop the relationships with these people. If you're stuck in your gym or your personal training studio or wherever you're doing what you're doing, you'll never get your name out except to a small bunch of people.

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